Erica and Dima are pretty steamed over my post from last week where I stated that Kanye West didn’t care about Bonnaroo people. I also called him a Diva in passing, which probably didn’t help ingratiate me with fans either.
Since that comment thread is now completely steeped in spiraling emotion from all sides, I’m going to clarify my thoughts here. If this topic is a deader horse to you than Secretariat, please feel free to move on.
I want to share some of what Kanye has said on his own blog today to help me flesh out my thoughts (read the full post for total context. Sorry or the all caps, they’re not mine):
[...] I’M FUCKING HURT BY THIS ONE. ALL I CARE ABOUT ARE THE FANS. JUST SAY THIS OUT LOUD IN A ROOM FULL OF PEOPLE, “KANYE DOESN’T CARE ABOUT GIVING A GOOD PERFORMANCE.” CAN ANYONE HONESTLY SAY THAT ????????? HAS ANYONE EVEN TAKEN THE TIME TO AT LEAST DO THE MATH??? BONNAROO SHOULD HAVE RELEASED A STATEMENT IN MY DEFENSE BUT SINCE THEY HAVEN’T LET’S BREAK DOWN THE WALLS ON THIS TRUMAN SHOW AND LET YOU KNOW WHAT REALLY OCCURRED!!! FOR OVER A MONTH WE WENT BACK AND FORTH ON WETHER OR NOT WE COULD EVEN FIT MY STAGE AT THE FESTIVAL. ONE DAY THEY WOULD SAY YES… WE’D SEND THEM OUR SPECS THEN THEY THEY’D SAY OK… THEN THEY WOULD SEND SPECS BACK THAT DIDN’T FIT THE STAGE. WE WERE OBVIOUSLY DEALING WITH FUCKING IDIOTS WHO DIDN’T REALLY HAVE THE CAPACITY TO REALLY PUT ON THIS SHOW PROPERLY. THEY TRIED 2 GIVE ME A TIME SLOT WERE IT WAS STILL LIGHT OUTSIDE … I HAVE A FUCKING LIGHT SHOW DUMB ASS, IT’S NOT CALLED GLOW IN THE DARK FOR NO REASON SQUID BRAINS! MY PEOPLE WORKED OUT A COMPROMISED STAGE PLOT AND A 3AM TIME SLOT AND I AGREED. FAST FOWARD TO THE DAY OF THE SHOW. MY PRODUCTION MANAGER TRIED TO LOAD IN FOR 24 HOURS BEFORE I WENT ON STAGE BUT THE FESTIVAL WOULDN’T ALLOW US TO DO ANYTHING UNTILL PEARL JAM LEFT THE STAGE. PEARL JAM ENDED ONE HOUR
LATE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AT THAT POINT WE’RE RACING AGAINST THE SUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AT 4:20AM DON COMES BACK 2 THE BUS AND TELLS ME, ” IT WOULD TAKE 45 MORE MINUTES TO PUT ALL YOUR PYRO IN!” I SAY I HAVE TO GET OUT THERE AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. [...]
Ok, let me try to present my thoughts in context to those comments:
“KANYE DOESN’T CARE ABOUT GIVING A GOOD PERFORMANCE.”
That was not the indictment I heard coming out of Bonnaroo.
People that I know, who were there, told me that Kanye’s attempt to put on the “Glow in the Dark” show by any means necessary was the problem they experienced. No one I know or any quote I’ve read has questioned his desire to put on the best show possible. People are questioning his decision to force his production setup into a situation where the outcome could affect the festival experience in a negative manner.
Speaking of his production setup…
[...] FOR OVER A MONTH WE WENT BACK AND FORTH ON WETHER OR NOT WE COULD EVEN FIT MY STAGE AT THE FESTIVAL. ONE DAY THEY WOULD SAY YES… WE’D SEND THEM OUR SPECS THEN THEY THEY’D SAY OK… THEN THEY WOULD SEND SPECS BACK THAT DIDN’T FIT THE STAGE. WE WERE OBVIOUSLY DEALING WITH FUCKING IDIOTS WHO DIDN’T REALLY HAVE THE CAPACITY TO REALLY PUT ON THIS SHOW PROPERLY. THEY TRIED 2 GIVE ME A TIME SLOT WERE IT WAS STILL LIGHT OUTSIDE … I HAVE A FUCKING LIGHT SHOW DUMB ASS, IT’S NOT CALLED GLOW IN THE DARK FOR NO REASON SQUID BRAINS! [...]
I understand that Kanye wanted to reach a different audience with his current production, but if Bonnaroo was having so many issues with the specs, why chance it? Either pull out all together or go with a toned down production setup, rock the mic and leave people wanting more. It’s not like he’s never rocked a set without the Glow in the Dark gear, right?
And I do understand that his whole show right now — set list and all — is dependent on interactions with this production. But if he’s that locked into his stage setup in order to perform, the decision to pull out should have been much easier to make. Similarly, Bonnaroo could have made the very same decision.
Obviously, the gig was important to both parties, so in the end his people pushed, Bonnaroo pushed back, they negotiated a reasonable solution that both parties agreed to and both proceeded to roll the dice of creating an uber headline time slot, which depended on everything running perfectly at 3am in the morning in order to come off.
[...] MY PEOPLE WORKED OUT A COMPROMISED STAGE PLOT AND A 3AM TIME SLOT AND I AGREED. FAST FOWARD TO THE DAY OF THE SHOW. MY PRODUCTION MANAGER TRIED TO LOAD IN FOR 24 HOURS BEFORE I WENT ON STAGE BUT THE FESTIVAL WOULDN’T ALLOW US TO DO ANYTHING UNTILL PEARL JAM LEFT THE STAGE. PEARL JAM ENDED ONE HOUR LATE!!!!!!!!!! AT THAT POINT WE’RE RACING AGAINST THE SUN!!!!!! AT 4:20AM DON COMES BACK 2 THE BUS AND TELLS ME, ” IT WOULD TAKE 45 MORE MINUTES TO PUT ALL YOUR PYRO IN!” I SAY I HAVE TO GET OUT THERE AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. [...]
Reading his account, as a human being, I can totally feel for the guy. I absolutely picture him pacing around, losing his mind more and more as each minute passed and the chance for dropping a great performance slipped farther and farther away from his grasp.
That said, I have little pity for the business man Kanye West. He empowered “his people” to leverage his influence, genre expanding potential, etc. to negotiate the Bonnaroo people into allow him to take the stage following the headline act with this complicated setup.
Bonnaroo blaming Pearl Jam for giving the crowd what they wanted would have done nothing except send a message to all future potential headliners that their headline status doesn’t mean much in reality.
Both parties messed up big time. The show should have never happened, but the promoters wanted the crowd to experience Kanye West and Kanye West wanted the exposure of the crowd, so they both took the risk.
And the people who stuck it out til 4:15am suffered for it.
I’m going to append my previous post title to reflect this new found conclusion — in the end, neither party cared much about the Bonnaroo people.
From the people I know who are into Hip-Hop and stayed for the show, they did say it was cool and a good performance. There is no doubt that Kanye is talented and that he understands big productions. As an entertainer, though, is not just as important to understand your audience?
With that said, I like most other people there was at Bonnaroo for music not light shows. BB King sat perfectly still and electrified the audience. There were other MC’s there who were bringing it in other late night sets in smaller venues. In the end, I’m more disappointed that I didn’t have a chance to see either his show (no matter the scale) or one of the other acts while I waited on him.
Well put, Sean. I think some valuable lessons were learned here. Kanye learned that playing a festival isn’t the same thing as playing your own show, and the promoter learned that perhaps it’s better to take a pass on performers with an overly-complicated setup, no matter how popular they are. Hopefully everyone will benefit in the long run.
People still aren’t getting the picture.
Ya’ll are still taking it as Kanye this “diva” prima donna wanted his show or nothing at all.
Can you imagine this: (as my imagination of the situation was more accurate)
+ They approach Kanye to do the show. (as i’m sure they do most artists)
+ Kanye’s says it’d be his pleasure. (as he loves impressing people)
+ The promoters say, “yea that glow in the dark thing you do is awesome and you’ve only had raving reviews and it would be a unique and awesome addition to the show.
+ Kanye’s people send the specs. Bonnaroo says great!!!!
+ the show is booked, announcements made, all are excited
+ unwilling to address their mistake in proper timing bonnaroo call’s kanye’s people (since i’m sure he’s not an engineer) and tell them they were actually wrong with the specs of their stages.
+ kanye and his “people” are like “hmm, that sucks, the fans would hate it if i cancelled, i work for my fans, let’s figure this out” and wow, bonnaroo was thinking the same thing. kanye’s engineers request specs for all stages and OH NO the only one that works is the main stage.
+Bonnaroo says “we’ll do whatever to get this show to the stage, we’re SOOO sorry please don’t cancel!!!!!!!”
+Bonnaroo’s mistake laden operation continues to “screw up life” and they continued this theme up to the very end of the concert.
Or in variation:
Kanye said all or nothing and Bonnaroo said okay to appease him. either way it’s still really selfish to say that he should have done things differently.
this or 100 other variations are possible. are people not that creative these days to give people the benefit of the doubt instead of casting judgement so fast?
it’s really messed up for one to try to imagine how someone else feels about things they are so passionate about.
sean specifically, how can you keep saying that either kanye or bonnaroo doesn’t care about the people that went? you have no proof whatsoever.
i’m not a kanye-a-holic i just think it’s petty to pursue this to put blame on everyone but the people who were impatient and selfish. is it not ironic how this was the ONLY crowd that didn’t like it? yes it was a festival and i agree it should have been different but it wasn’t, are the festival goers so close-minded? I would imagine so, that’s my opinion but I wont come out and say PEOPLE WHO GO TO FESTIVALS ARE CLOSED-MINDED that would be ridiculous, as I feel these posts are…….
but i’m okay with this post since it’s your opinion but it doesn’t make things better when you change titles of blogs to make your opinion seem more founded when there’s nothing to support the statements.
BillO does the same thing and that’s really hard to swallow.
sean i’m sorry!
but do you get what i’m saying?
thanks for your opinion, i’ve said that so many times, but when you use your opinion to make statements as fact it’s hard to swallow and thus makes me keep giving my opinion.
again, i’m just asking why go as far as to say “bonnaroo and kanye doesn’t care about the bonaroo people” or however you phrased it.
i would not have said a word if instead it was, “bonaroo people are pissed the f*** off about kanye” you could have even said “i don’t really like kanye and here’s my way of pretending like this is the truth so i can feel more resolute in my opinion of disgust in his personality.”
erica, let me be super clear about this one thing. please take it at face value, as this is a no spin zone at DMP (ha!)… until these last few days, i had never paused one second to consider what kanye west’s “personality” is about.
aside from his timely drop about george bush, a few of his high profile songs and the random hollywood noise i hear about him as i move about the web, i know very little about the dude.
i’m neither a fan nor a hater. i’d rather listen to j-live, little brother, the roots, hell, 50 other hip hop acts before i’d give him a spin.
again, not hating, just never really interested.
what i have heard on the fly about him gave me the impression that he was a bit more diva’ish than some other emcee’s that i dig, which is fine. though i would add that i have never once uttered “diva and kanye” in the same sentence online, in the meat space or between my ears until this past weekend.
i altered the other post title to include the bonnaroo folks in this mess because after going through the process of reading kanye’s fit and writing this post, i concluded they were complicit, too.
(btw, the URL of the other post is the same as the original and i updated the post to point to the thought process in this post. i didn’t try to make my “opinion seem more founded” i tried to show that it had evolved.)
as a promoter, i would *never* run such shit on my headline act, leaving them open for criticism because they played an encore for the thousands of fans who came out to specifically see them.
that’s what bonnaroo did, and it shows little respect for pearl jam and the diehards who in the midst of staying up until dawn for three straight nights, had to wait what probably seemed like forever to catch kanye’s performance.
sorry. i can’t get pissed at the audience for being tired and pissy. they’re the customers. they’re you or me on another day, in another field at another festival and i can totally connect with their degree of pissedoffness.
i re-purposed kanye’s most famous freestyle to shine a spotlight on him (and eventually, the promotions staff) because my friends who were there were pretty damn pissed at the experience.
i’m not apologizing for that.
wow. just found/heard about this (yes, i’m two years late):
no, i can’t imagine kanye being a prick. holy shit.
i’m in absolute awe of his ego.
oh goodness, i wouldn’t want you to apologize.
please continue to feel the way you feel; please continue to voice your opinion and bring new things to the people that might not like or feel the same way.
please do not take any of what i just said as sarcastic.
speak your truth and believe in it.
don’t care what others think about what you say because that will only dilute who you are.
i’m not saying get pissed at the fans either. i said with a title like “bonnaroo people are pissed at kanye” it wouldn’t be so wrong. as in you don’t know how kanye feels about the people (until now) but you do know how the fans feels. they have their right to be mad. i’m mad at michael jackson and i don’t expect anyone to change that position. the difference is: if i came out with a post that said, “mj thinks nasty thoughts about children”. i would HOPE someone would call me out because only if i was him could i make that revelation.
you’re making assumptions, and i like that you put your opinion. but i’ll keep putting my opinion as well. we’ll keep this back and forth although with each comment i thought i’d have less to say :/ unfortunately, i don’t.
so we have kanye’s pov and from what you posted it seems like bonnaroo messed up severly. kanye may have had something to do with that. but i just don’t get how you can come with the statement that he or the promoter doesn’t care about bonnaroo people.
you said it’s based on deductive reasoning, but there’s only opinion here. keep your opinion but nothing there is deductive.
i’ve found a new hobby…
make that a new life calling…
HA!
hahaha Sean, you know you can state your OPINIONS without all the sarcasm. It would make for such a more civilized debate.
“You can spend minutes, hours, days, weeks or even months over analyzing a situation. Trying to put the pieces together, justifying what could’ve, and would’ve happened… or you can just leave the peices on the floor.”
-Tupac
Once again, there are no grounds for stating ‘Kanye doesn’t care about Bonnaroo people,’ as a fact. My problem is not your opinion of him and his ego. He DOES have a HUGE ego and everyone knows it, including his fans. Thats been well known since day one of Kanye’s fame. But that does not support your argument about him not caring about Bonnaroo people. Just because he thinks he’s amazing doesn’t make his opinion about others any less.
“…and it shows little respect for pearl jam and the diehards who in the midst of staying up until dawn for three straight nights, had to wait what probably seemed like forever to catch kanye’s performance.”
This is your opinion, and thats great, but I dont agree with that either. I don’t think it shows a lack of respect for pearl jam and the diehard fans. They still got to see them perform and give a great show and got a whole extra hour of it at that.
Erica and I went to Duke to see a concert with the Roots and Third Eye Blind. We were really mainly going to see the Roots, and considering it was a college campus and most everyone was out there for them, we assumed the Roots were going to be the main event. We got there pretty late because we got lost on the way… Duke campus is kinda crazy by the way! anyways, when we got there we missed them because it turned out that Third Eye Blind was the main event, and they played for much longer too. Since I was passing out flyers for Inflowential when I was there, I talked to a lot of random people that night who all came to see the Roots and were surprised and upset that they played first.
Someone at Duke University thought that Third Eye Blind should play last even though the crowd did not agree, atleast as many people that I spoke too, which was a lot. (but I’m not putting any numbers exactly because I’m not going to pretend i counted)
Just because that happened, does not mean that the Roots felt disrespected, or that even the people in the audience thought it was udder disrespect to them, because everyone is well aware that they are both very well known groups with high reputations. (Just like Pearl Jam and Kanye West) Just because it was not the best decision on Duke’s part doesn’t mean that Duke doesn’t care about their students or what they want. It was just a bad call on somebody’s (who we will never know) part.
the disrespect to pearl jam occurred in the re-scheduling, though they were ego-less by allowing the festival to schedule kanye. obviously, they didn’t plan on worrying about time. but as the headliners, you can’t blame them for that.
afterwards, the disrespect was crazy.
kanye complaining about the headline act of a three day festival going long, messing up his set, is beyond a level of arrogance that i can even conceive. that’s some serious passive aggressive blame being hurled at the primary draw for the festival. if he couldn’t see getting on after the headliner as a potential issue, then he wasn’t thinking about the logistics and just being short-sighted to his own gains.
similarly, bonnaroo agreeing to put kanye on after the headline act is a worse act of short-sightedness — they’re the damn promoters of the event! — and just as disrespectful to pearl jam, the audience and kanye. if they stuck to their guns about what a headline act actually meant, the band wouldn’t be in kanye’s blubbering mouth nor in the midst of all this stupidity.
btw, weren’t you like 9 years old when tupac died?
okay, “pearl jam was ego-less by allowing the festival to schedule kanye”? i’m glad you think the show was what it was just because of pearl jam and not the combination of artists and fans. again, it’s disrespectful for them to not be respectful, obviously.
have you not read any of my comments about how you are jumping to ridiculous conclusions, are you doing that and saying outlandish things so we keep commenting?
you’re clever with your videos, but now you’re stating the obvious.
who doesn’t know kanye thinks he’s the best?
find me an artist that isn’t confident about him or herself.
or is kanye’s opinion of himself something you don’t want to hear about.
obviously
with these videos you’re only proving my point that you’re not acting like you like his personality and that he’s a jerk, and a jerk does as jerk’s do.
the jerk thing of him would be to move his set because he wanted more attention and didn’t care about people because jerks don’t care about people.
you have yet to explain why you would go as far as to say as much. (why kanye doesn’t like bonnaroo people when it’s only obvious that they don’t like him) when you don’t, it just becomes more apparent that you probably just don’t like his opinion and want to post this up because it kinda furthers your truth by finding others that are upset as well.
notice the use of probably just now. i’m not going to say you feel a certain way, because i’m not you and can’t say how you feel.
wow sean, yes point out how much older you are than we are. it shows how low you’ll stoop to prove your point/validity..
and again back to the age thing since you put that up there, just like you first started putting people’s name in the mix (condescendingly), and primary use sarcasm to actually not prove your point..
you’re right at the age where pearl jam was the best thing ever, something not too familiar to most of our generation (for better or worse) and you really think they can do no wrong. pretty pathetic. when your boss (bonnaroo) tells you to do something (get off the stage at the time they say) at least try to be courteous, they were probably mad like you that they weren’t going to be the last band. instead of acting mature like you’re not acting, they made it worse for all parties involved. time spots change all the time up to the concert. dima actually really like pearl jam. i think they’re just okay. it’s my opinion and it doesn’t alter my common sense on this situation. hey, everybody can do wrong. pearl jam was inconsiderate.
i know you’ve been on this earth quite a bit longer than i have but i’m curious to know if you’ve put on more events than i have in so many different genres that i work with. you are using your experience to say “well little girls i’ve put on some events and i know more about this so go and play grown up in the hollywood sun” i wasn’t just promoting those shows. i do logistics.
i hope you’re done with this madness.
haha. bonnaroo is not pearl jam’s boss.
erica, are you speaking for you or both you and dima? everything you’re saying about personal jabs, you are completely bringing to the table. if you don’t agree with me, fine, but you’re the one making this personal. seriously.
i’m done if you are.
please post yes to end this and (bonus) get the last word.
oh my goodness.
bonnaroo and the fans are pearl jam’s boss, actually.
pearl jam does not hold this event and ask others to join them, actually.
i’m pretty sure bonnaroo pays pearl jam from on the fans and sponsors’ money, actually.
looks like a duck.
when artists don’t realize who gave them the opportunity we get arrogant bands like pearl jam screwing up huge shows. yes. it’s the opportunity, or are they bigger than the event and not needing people anymore?!
nope, i am speaking for myself. i think it’s just that you’re not making any sense and we do agree on that. i have to bring everything to the table because you’re attacking her and i wont tolerate that. if she was nine when he died that doesn’t mean that his music is less relevant or that she’s any less mature than you..
and i’m sure you’re not going to respond after this because for the first time you’re going to do something that you think makes you look like the more mature one and i salute you for that? you’ve done immature things in the past and i think people can change. can you give kanye that same respect?
i would hope so.
i’m glad these comments could end on such a great note :)
(or does that smiley make me look young? i don’t care)
well speaking for myself, Im not sorry that when I was 9, I was not listening to only music in “my generation.” And I didn’t know that was a bad thing.
And if this is about getting the last word… then my answer is No.
And to think this all started with a little parody of Kanye’s comments following Katrina for a headline…
It is funny how Erica and Dima have turned into a two person crusading crew to defend Kanye and to project their alternative viewpoints onto the situation. You are inventing an alternate universe where Kanye is a victim and everyone is out to sabotage his plans to give the performance of a lifetime. You guys were not even there and a couple of us posting here that were in the group that was waiting till 4:25 am. Now I am under no illusion that because I was in the crowd waiting that I have any more insight into the backstage and planning and workings but I certainly was there and know that there was a lot of anticipation for a great show from Kanye, I planned my whole day around it…
…Back to the point, I have read every post in both of these threads and it all comes back to the headline. IT WAS PARODY, pure and simple. You guys know Sean and know what he is about. He is about community, music and people. If you guys can just agree to disagree on this its fine. There is plenty of positive things and common ground that deserve this energy.
awwww…. Sean… I just saw your video “crazy” that you threw in.
Is that supposed to be subliminal messaging to say we’re crazy???
Because if so… we already knew! I promise we’re smarter then you think ;)
no, dima, we’re all crazy. at least that’s what i get from the lyrics. i never for a second considered you dumb on any level.
yes we are all crazy! :) I really do believe that…